“从突破性创新到渐进式改进，对我来说都是创新 ”｜专访 Mr. Earl F. Bardsley

写在前面

“Earl F. Bardsley” 这是一个在心脏及神经介入产品发展史上不可或缺的名字Bigone。在采访他之前，我了解到他的一些习惯和爱好，让我对他充满了好奇。

他高度自律，每天凌晨4点起床，5点到公司，数十年如一日Bigone。他向往自由，喜欢骑哈雷摩托车。正如哲学家康德所说：“真正的自由不是随心所欲，而是自我主宰。自律即自由。”这种身体的高度自律和大脑的极度自由，也在他不断研发和创新的产品上，体现的淋漓尽致。

镜头前的Earl先生，散发着岁月铸就的成熟魅力Bigone。他带着一条非常潮的领带，我称赞他今天看起来很帅。他哈哈一笑，回应我：“As my wife tells me，but she is the only one who says it”。他的幽默和风趣让我们的谈话轻松而愉快。当我们谈到欧美医生对中国品牌是否存在偏见时，他的回答给了我全新的思考。

看着镜头里的他，我脑海里闪现出凌晨5点钟加州尔湾的公路上，一位洒脱奔放爱自由的研发工程师骑着哈雷摩托车去上班的场景Bigone。

这位老小伙儿Bigone，有点儿意思！

采访：金井子

编辑：任晓丹

校对：金永美

本期访谈嘉宾：

Mr. Earl F. Bardsley

沃比医疗首席技术官

展开全文

Q1

通常，我们认为喜欢骑哈雷摩托车的人性格自由不羁Bigone。我听说您很喜欢骑哈雷摩托车，但又是个很自律的人——十年如一日保持着早起的习惯。您是如何做到既自律又自由的呢？对您的职业发展有什么影响呢？

I heard you are a fan of Harley Davison. I also heard you get up very early every day and stick to this schedule for years. How should we understand the seemingly conflict between your self-discipline and the spirit of FreedomBigone？What have self-discipline and spirit of Freedom for all brought to your career？

A1：每天早上五点半之前，我就已经开始办公了，对我的合作伙伴和同事们来说的确很早Bigone。早起办公的好处之一是便于进行跨时区商务沟通。早睡早起是我从小的生活习惯，因为我从六七岁开始练习冰球，一直坚持到高中毕业，每天都要早起训练。

Yes, my colleagues think I rise early as I'm in the office at 5:00AM or 5:30AM. For many people I work with, this is early. This does provide an opportunity to take calls with other countries that we're doing business. There is a time management advantage to starting early. For myself, I always have been an early riser. This goes back to when I was very young and playing ice hockey, that to get ice time, as it's called, was done early in the morning. I started playing ice hockey when I was 6 or 7 years old. So, I was always up early to be able to participate. This continued through high school and then post high school.

上大学的时候，我兼职开货车赚学费，大清早就要奔波在路上，也是在那时候养成了凌晨四点起床的习惯，一直保持到现在Bigone。对我来说，早起不是个难事，但我晚上睡得也很早，八点半就开始打瞌睡了，不像我的同事们会工作到凌晨。每个人的生物钟是不一样的，在时间的一端获益意味着需要在另一端舍弃。

When I was in college, I drove a tractor trailer, big truck to make money for college. This required very early morning “runs” to make these deliveries. Usually, 4:00 AM in the morning was the time to wake up and I carried that forward into professional life. For me, to get up early is just natural. Of course, on the other side in the evening come 8:30PM, I’m getting very tired where my colleagues might be up till midnight. I’m starting to doze off at 8:30PM. So, what you gain on one side of the clock, you give up on the other side of the clock.

当然，自律不只体现在早起，它也是促使我们在产品研发上精益求精以满足临床需求的驱动力之一，没有不放弃、不将就的信念是做不到的Bigone。追求卓越的创新精神是沃比医疗的企业价值观，它驱动着我们设计并生产出满足甚至超越国际标准的医疗器械，如：Avenir机械解脱弹簧圈和Esperence ® 远端通路导管和抽吸导管。

Self-discipline carries onto many aspects of life, one of which is the drive to complete product design to high quality and meeting the requirements of physicians. This is only achieved by not giving up and not settling for less than best in class. This spirit of excellence is part of Wallaby Medical’s culture, the drive to design and manufacture medical devices that meet or exceed international standards. This is clearly seen on the Avenir embolic coil and the Esperance ® catheters.

同时，具有创造力的研发人员需要自由度才能实现新理念的创新Bigone。许多情况下，这一创新之旅的起点是来自医生对其未被满足的临床需求的反馈。一旦明确临床需求，研发人员就能开始有的放矢的创新，但更重要的是，这一创新之旅是没有先例可循，需要研发人员拥有充分自由度进行不断探寻和尝试，从而形成创新产品。

For R&D professionals to innovate, there must be freedom to explore new concepts for technology. The starting point for this exploration in many cases is input from clinicians for an unmet clinical need. Once the need is identified, R&D professionals can begin the innovation process, but it is important that they are not bound to a predetermined concept. It is the exploration process through freedom to investigate and try new concepts that will deliver innovative products.

Q2

支持您在神经介入研发领域深耕30多年的热情和动力来自哪里Bigone？

Understand you’ve been in the field of Neurovascular R&D for more than 30 years, where does your passion and motivation on R&D come from?

A2：我认为，所有医疗器械的从业者都对研发新器械充满热情Bigone。无论是从事市场营销、生产还是研发，我们都参与到了研发过程。我们研发的医疗器械可以挽救患者的生命并改善他们的生活质量，这对我而言意义重大。当我和医生共同研发新产品时，他们会与我分享这款产品对于患者的临床获益，为我这样的研发人员提供了持续创新和研发产品的驱动力。

Yes, I think all medical device professionals, in all disciplines in this industry, have a passion to develop these devices. That's across all aspects whether you're in marketing, trying to get the device to market, manufacturing, making the device or research and development. We are all developing the device. This carries forward that you are developing devices that are going to serve the patient and help provide better lives to people. So, for myself, this has always been an important part of my career. As you are developing a device, you're working with physicians on the device, and they're explaining the benefit to you that the patient will have. This really provides a drive for all professionals to get these devices done.

当然，在研发的产品商业化之后，看到产品在临床上被使用，这真是振奋人心的事情，而且绝不会随着时间的推移而减少Bigone。看到自己研发的新产品推向市场，应用于临床，并正在挽救患者的生命，这是我持续创新和研发新产品的驱动力。

And of course, as you are developing the device in R&D, and you're completing the design and bringing the device to market, it provides an opportunity where now you can go out into the clinic and see this device that you designed get used. And it's a big thrill that doesn't get less over time. Every time you do this with a new device, see it go to market, see it get used to improve patient care, this inspires you for the next device that's going to be developed.

Q3

您为什么会放弃继续在全球知名跨国器械公司担任研发高层Bigone，而选择加入沃比医疗这家中国公司开始创业？

What main features of Wallaby Medical have attracted you to give up your senior position in a well-known multinational company and join a Chinese start-up companyBigone？

A3：说来话长，我长话短说Bigone。在2014年底，经共同的朋友介绍，我认识了沃比医疗的CEO安穆克先生和董事长刘冰先生。2015年，我们花了一整年探讨创业的可行性。他俩创立沃比医疗的愿景是集中国和美国之长，成为全球挽救中风患者生命最多的一家公司，这一点非常打动我。

This is a long story. I'll try to keep it short. I met Michael Alper and Bing Liu through a mutual friend. Michael is Wallaby’s CEO and Bing is Wallaby’s chairman of the board. I met them very late in 2014. All through 2015, we talked about starting the company. They got me very interested as they shared their vision of starting a company that would combine the best of the US, with the best of China, to create a company that would develop stroke products to serve patients and save the most lives that have been impacted by stroke.

2015年，我与安穆克和刘冰多次深入沟通后，很明确自己愿意投身其中Bigone。沃比医疗的愿景和我的个人规划是一致的。当我告诉妻子准备辞职创业时，她反复询问：“你真的想清楚了吗？你确定要和两个只见过一面、没有启动资金、没有员工、没有办公场地且定居在遥远中国的人共同创业吗？这是你想要的吗？”的确，她的追问提醒着我这一创业计划并非是周全且毫无风险的，但我依旧坚定，因为我们仨各有所长，一定能合力运营好一家成功的公司。于是，2016年我就辞职加入沃比医疗，协助其美国分公司的设立及运营。截至目前，这段创业历程是我难忘且美好的经验。

As I talked with them through 2015, I became convinced that this was something I wanted to be involved with. All sounded good to me. I had a lot of conversations with Michael and Bing through 2015. When I told my wife that I was going to quit my job to start this company, she played back to me what I told her, starting with, “let me get this straight.” “You're going to join two guys that live in China that you met once, that have no money, no employees, no building, to start a company. Does this really sound like a good idea?” As it was played back to me, maybe it didn't sound like a solid plan, but I remain convinced that when I looked at Michael, myself and Bing, our three backgrounds were very differentiated. I thought we had the right mix to make a successful company. So, in 2016, I resigned my position, and we formed the US entity of Wallaby Medical. From there, it's just been a tremendous experience and very positive.

当我回顾过去的决定，它们有些本应该可以很成功，有些可能没那么成功，还有些非常成功，但对于沃比医疗来说，这是正确的决定，一切都那么顺利Bigone。

As I look back on that decision, what could have worked out or maybe not worked out, worked out great for Wallaby Medical. It was the right decision. Everything is going well.

Q4

您觉得这家中国公司和之前任职的全球知名外企Bigone，最大的相同点及不同点是什么？

What do you think about the biggest differences between this Chinese company and the previous world- famous one?

A4：我对中国公司的了解并不多，因为沃比医疗是我唯一任职过的中国公司Bigone。我们创立沃比医疗的初衷是集中国和美国之长，成为全球挽救中风患者生命最多的一家公司。我们为企业文化注入高度的道德价值观，一开始我们便致力于生产最为优质的医疗产品，并将产品推向包括欧洲、美国和中国在内的全球市场。可靠的产品质量是医疗器械产品畅行全球必备的“通行证”。

A lot of what I hear about Chinese companies is hearsay.Wallaby Medical is the only Chinese company that I worked for. When we started the company, the intent was to take the best of what could happen in the US and the best of what could happen in China. The products from the start of the company would be high quality and the culture that was getting instilled in the company was of high ethical value. We were going to develop products that were of top quality. We’re going to manufacture products of top quality. The intent being, we were going to be selling products internationally, and physicians in Europe, US, China, and in all countries expect a certain level of quality for medical devices.

沃比医疗的独特之处在于，我们是一家总部位于中国，以中美为基础的全球公司Bigone。我们是少数成功将产品推向全球市场的中国医疗器械公司，因此我们需要符合国际一流标准。

So, Wallaby is differentiated from other companies in that we are a US and China based company with China being our headquarters. We are one of the few Chinese medical device companies that is selling internationally, therefore, we have to meet international standards.

我可以评价沃比医疗，但我不能拿沃比医疗和其他中国公司去比较，因为我没有其他中国公司的工作经验，我只能说，沃比医疗正在研发并生产国际一流品质标准的产品Bigone。

I can say that about Wallaby, but I can't contrast to a Chinese company because I haven't worked in one, but I can say we're producing international quality products.

Q5

您是如何突破30多年弹簧圈研发经验的框架思维Bigone，实现了Avenir弹簧圈的创新？

How would you describe the break-through you have achieved in Avenir coil to the established frame of thinking in coil products after your working on coil R&D for more than 30 years?

A5：我之前任职过的几家公司，他们的弹簧圈及其它神经介入产品都还有改进的空间Bigone。可以说，任何产品都不是完美的，只要能让临床应用起来更简单便捷、患者的临床获益更高，就值得我们继续去完善。因此，我也是在弹簧圈的研发领域不断地精益求精。

Yes, so for coil products I’ve worked on them in a few companies as well as a host of other products. With any product there is always room for innovation, anything to make the physician experience easier, the patient outcome better. I knew from working on coils that there was room for improvement.

Avenir弹簧圈产品的最终定型是经过大量中国专家的建议才得以实现Bigone。几年前，我曾出差到中国，安穆克先生与我拜访了很多中国医生。我也与他们进行了讨论和沟通，咨询他们对中国市场现有产品的评价，平时使用的是国产品牌还是进口品牌，有哪些不足，他们在临床真正的需求是什么？他们对新一代弹簧圈产品的期望是什么……我们坐在一起讨论哪些临床需求未被满足。对我而言，与中国临床专家的讨论结果和我的预期截然不同，这令我惊讶，因为我原本以为中国医生的想法和欧美医生没什么差别。

When I look at the final product we developed, a lot of the input came from physicians in China. I traveled to China very early on in the company. Michael and I met with many physicians in China and talked with them, asked when they looked at the products they had right now, whether they were locally produced or whether they were imported, what was lacking? What did they really want? If they had their chance just to say I have a new coil, what do I want? We sat with them and talked through what was missing. For myself, I came away from those meetings surprised, because I expected physicians in China to say the same thing that physicians were saying in the US, the same thing that they were saying in Europe.

但中国医生的临床需求的确不同于欧美，这也推动了我们在产品上的研发设计Bigone。这一差异性主要体现在，部分弹簧圈产品不得不通过与推送导丝的分离进行解脱，大部分情况需使用外部机械装置或高成本的解脱能量组件来实现解脱。中国医生希望能够摆脱这些外部解脱装置和高成本的解脱能量组件，这对我们研发来说是个很大的挑战。和中国医生就产品的设计和研发进行深入交流之后，我们带着明确的研发需求和任务满载而归。

They definitely differentiated themselves and pushed us on the design. A big part of that differentiation was when you look at a coil product, part of the technology is you have to detach the coil from the pusher wire. In many cases this is done by having either an external mechanical handle or expensive energy source. The physicians in China really pushed us that you need to eliminate the handle and expensive energy component on the product. This was a difficult task to do. We left those meetings with the mission and an understanding from the voice of customer input from the physicians in China to design and innovate the product.

最终，沃比医疗推出的弹簧圈产品就其创新性而言，在一定程度上超越其他大型公司的现有同类产品Bigone。能有这样的创新产品离不开中国临床医生对产品设计的建议和意见。现在，这款产品的临床应用在全球广受好评。

In the end, we have certainly ended up with a product that has a level of innovation that is above the current products that are being produced by the larger companies. This innovation was the result of customer input from physicians in China that paid out in the product design. The product is working well in the market and being received well.

Q6

有人说：“在原有的产品上改一下尺寸Bigone，这不算创新”，您认为创新必须是颠覆性的还是在原有设计上进行改良？

How would you define “innovation”, only some fundamental change or it could be an improvement, even if slight change, on the original design?

A6：好问题！无论是颠覆性的突破还是小步迭代的改良，都是创新的体现Bigone。AI人工智能在脑卒中治疗领域的应用就是一种颠覆性的创新，它正在改变医生对缺血性脑卒中的诊疗模式。产品渐进式的改良能够提升术者的操作体验，并改善患者的疗效，这也是一种创新。也适用于我们日常生活中购买的任何一款产品。有时我们会习以为常，但产品设计上的小改良，例如在产品使用上进行一定程度的创新，就能大大提升我们的使用体验。

Yes, that’s a good question. I definitely think of innovation as both a disruptive technology, such as artificial intelligence that's coming into stroke treatment, and incremental improvements. Artificial intelligence is a breakthrough technology that is changing the approach to ischemic stroke treatment for physicians. Incremental changes in a product that enhance the physician experience that provides superior care to the patient are also innovative. This goes across all products, any product that we buy in daily life. We may take it for granted, but a small change in the design, how the product is used as a level of innovation that enhances your experience with the product.

毫无疑问，Avenir机械解脱弹簧圈也是一款在设计和研发上具备创新水平的产品Bigone。这也耗费了我们大量的工程设计。当临床医生开始使用这款产品时，其产品的易操作性令他们刮目相看，这简化了医生在临床上的应用。一旦成功应用，通常术者会开始将Avenir弹簧圈用于临床常规使用。因此，无论是颠覆性的突破还是小步迭代的改良，对我来说，都是创新的体现。

We had no doubt when we look at Wallaby Medical's Avenir coil, that the design of the product is absolutely a level of innovation. It required a lot of engineering to develop this product. When physicians use the product, they’re very surprised at the simplicity of using it, and this simplifies their experience in the clinic with the product. From there, typically, they will start to adopt the product into their practice. So, all levels of innovation from breakthrough to incremental, for me, it's all innovation.

Q7

欧美医生对中国品牌存在认知偏见吗Bigone？

Do European and American doctors have some bias towards Chinese brands?

A7：国际市场上主流的医疗器械产品，主要都来自欧美企业，这是我的第一印象Bigone。中国也有非常多的医疗器械公司，但大部分都服务于中国本土市场。因此，不少中国医疗器械产品并未在国际市场供国际医生进行使用。

When I think of medical products on the international market, most of the medical device companies are in the US and Europe. China has many medical device companies, but for the most part they are serving the local market in China. So, a lot of the products do not make it out of China for international physicians to experience.

因此，从一开始的问题是，当你向医生介绍来自中国的产品时，他们并没有使用该产品的经验Bigone。俗话说的好，良好的第一印象是成功的一半，这是我们的挑战，也是我们的机遇。我有过亲身经历，部分国际市场的医生发现我们的产品是一个中国品牌，可能对中国品牌有刻板印象，这往往取决于他们个人对中国品牌的不了解。一旦他们开始使用产品，临床使用的体验很好、对产品质量也满意，他不但愿意继续使用我们的产品，而且还摒弃了对中国品牌的刻板印象。

So, right from the start there is a problem when you present a product from China to a physician that they don't have experience with that product. As the saying goes, you get one chance to make a good first impression, and you get one chance to make a bad impression. What I have experienced when physicians find out the product is made in China, and this certainly depends on the individual, there can be a negative bias. Once they try the product and discover the quality is exceptional, they are willing to use the product and you will get them over that bias.

所以我认为，对于包括中国在内的来自全球其他国家的公司，在开拓国际市场时，必须保证自己的产品与医生目前使用的产品一样性能优异Bigone。如果他们在第一次使用产品时体验不佳，那么很容易会对产品的产地产生负面的刻板印象。

For companies worldwide and absolutely including China, as you approach the international stage with products, your products have to be of the same quality as products that physicians are currently using, if not, and they have a bad experience the first time using the product, they will quickly generate a negative impression of where the product is made.

因此，对所有有志于进军国际市场的中国医疗器械企业来说，他们需要时刻铭记，这些器械必须与其他跨国公司的产品同样优质，否则很难获得市场份额Bigone。想象一下，如果你家里添置了一件物品有质量问题，你肯定会对这款物品和它的生产厂家产生负面印象。家里东西坏了还能买新的，但医疗器械有质量问题可都是性命攸关的大事，临床术者不可能再使用这款产品了。因此，产品设计和生产时的质量控制是赢得客户的关键因素。

For all companies in China, if they plan to market international devices, they have to keep in mind those devices have to be on the same quality as coming out of the international companies, otherwise, they just will not get the market share. Consider a product you buy for your home that doesn't meet your quality standard and breaks, no matter where it's made leaves you as a consumer with a bad impression of the product and company. Yes, that's unfortunate if your home product breaks, but for a medical device when a physician uses it and it breaks the first time, more than likely you won't get a second opportunity to try the product again. So, quality of design, quality of manufacturing are critical to maintaining a customer base.

Q8

在您研发的众多产品中Bigone，哪个产品的创新落地最有挑战？为什么？

Among all the products you have developed, which product is the most challenging one and why?

A8：我遇到最有挑战的一款产品并非来自神经介入领域，而是用于治疗房颤的Bigone。当患者心律失常时，心脏跳动不规律，颤动并不泵血。这类患者的治疗方案可以是植入除颤器。除颤器作为脉冲发生器，通过手术植入到胸腔肌肉区，并通过电极和患者心脏相连。

I'm going to use an example that is not part of neurovascular. This relates to heart disease for patients that suffer from atrial fibrillation, where your heart doesn't beat as it should, it just flutters and the heart is not pumping blood. Patients end up with a defibrillator that's implanted in them. The defibrillator is a disk that gets surgically implanted in your pectoral muscle area. Then you have electrical leads that go to your heart from the defibrillator.

患者如果植入了除颤器，可以在胸部区域明显地看到类似圆盘的植入物Bigone。一旦患者发生房颤，除颤器将发射电脉冲使心脏恢复正常水平。我曾经在一家初创公司任职，致力于研发一款可植入腔室的、管状结构的除颤器。如此患者可通过简单的微创导管手术完成除颤器的植入，而不是开放式手术。这在技术上是颠覆式的创新。将所有电子元件置入一根柔韧的管道中，而且其算法需支持正确定位房颤，还需适应人体的生物和机械环境，这是个巨大的挑战。

If you have a defibrillator implanted, it can be pronounced in your chest region, because it's a disk that gets implanted. This is a device that absolutely is required if you go into fibrillation, it will shock your heart back into normal rhythm. The company that I speak of was a startup company that I worked for. We were taking defibrillator technology, the electronics, the software, everything in the disk, and we were making this into a tubular structure that would be implanted in your vena cava. This could be done by a simple catheter procedure, no invasive surgery. This was a technically challenging feat to accomplish. Taking the electronics and getting them into a flexible tube with the algorithms that can survive the human biological and mechanical environment was a tremendous challenge.

其次，是设计能将该管状除颤器植入并固定在体内的机械装置Bigone。另外，还需考虑电极必须定位并固定在心肌。除此以外，除颤器是靠电池运行的，而电池是有使用的寿命，所以当除颤器电量耗竭时，还需要将除颤器移除体外。我们不但要研发出除颤器，还要研发出能够将这款除颤器植入体内并移出体外的配套器械。这是另外一套由三到四个导管类产品组成的装置。

The other part was the mechanical devices to be able to take this tubular defibrillator, implant it in the body, anchor it in the body so it didn't move. Then, consider the electrical leads that had to be positioned and fixed into the heart muscle. If that wasn't enough, defibrillators run on batteries and batteries have an end of life. So, at the end of the life of the device, you have to explant it or take it out of the body. We had to develop all of the instrumentation to go in and remove this device from the body. This was another set of three or four catheter-based instruments.

我们当时将该项产品技术推进到了临床实验阶段，尽管临床结果表现很不错，但在当时的经济环境下，公司无法获得更多的融资，难以负担将产品技术推向市场实现商业化的成本Bigone。但显然，从临床理念再到临床应用，这是一项意义重大的医学突破。未来，希望有其他的投资者和研发工程师能够把这款技术商业化并应用于挽救患者的生命。对我而言，其意义是能够参与到这项非常挑战的产品技术研发和应用，从最初的理念到其投入临床试验。

We took that technology we developed into a clinical trial. Although the clinical results were going well, this was one of those cases when you look at a good technology, the cost to bring it to market, unfortunately the economic environment at the time did not align. Given the economic environment, and the stage the company was working, unfortunately, the company could not continue to get funded. But clearly an engineering feat to take from idea into humans and see it work. Hopefully, at some point, other investors and engineers will pick up that idea and carry it forward. For myself, personally working on that idea from very early to bringing it into the clinic, just a very challenging device to get developed and used.

Q9

在神经介入发展史中Bigone，您觉得哪一项产品具有里程碑意义？

Which product do you think is the milestone in the history of Neurovascular development?

A9：和许多其他医学领域一样，很多医疗器械的发明是颠覆性的，彻底改变了动脉瘤和缺血性脑卒中的治疗理念Bigone。例如，由加州大学洛杉矶分校的Guglielmi医生率先研发出来用于治疗动脉瘤的弹簧圈。这是一个革命性的突破。对于许多颅内动脉瘤患者来说，在弹簧圈面市之前只能选择开颅手术治疗。手术难易取决于颅内动脉瘤所处的位置，部分位置会使开颅手术变得非常困难。所以弹簧圈栓塞为颅内动脉瘤患者提供新的解决方案。当首款弹簧圈刚被研发出来时，大家都无法料想到现今弹簧圈的性能会变得如此优异、临床操作会变得如此便捷。

When I think of this now, of course, like all areas of medicine there have been inventions that have come along, devices that have come along, that absolutely have changed the face of treating aneurysms and ischemic stroke. I would like to name a few of them. Certainly, the embolic coil that was first developed at UCLA by Dr. Guglielmi to treat aneurisms. This was a breakthrough that for many patients presented an option to open surgery to have an aneurysm repaired. Surgery can be very difficult depending on where the aneurysm is located in the brain. For patients, this therapy created another lifesaving alternative. When you look back at that first coil, most people would have never thought we would be where we are today when you look at how easy the products are to use now.

当然，尽管在8年前，缺血性卒中会导致较高的致死致残率，但如今支架取栓治疗能让患者从昏迷中苏醒，并在几天后功能恢复正常并出院Bigone。显然取栓支架也是一个颠覆性的医疗器械。

Certainly, stent retriever technology for ischemic stroke, which is allowing patients that even 8 years ago may have been debilitated from having a stroke, now wake up and walk out of the hospital after a few days and have very little deficit to no deficit. Clearly a breakthrough medical device.

如今，血流导向装置则是另一个颠覆性的、治疗颅内动脉瘤的医疗器械，其能防止患者因为颅内动脉瘤破裂所导致的致死致残Bigone。

And then, flow diverters for aneurysm treatment, a therapy that is also providing another breakthrough medical device for the treatment of aneurysms, and prevention of an aneurysm from bursting and debilitating or causing death of a patient.

综上，以上三种医疗器械是我认为现在具有里程碑意义的神经介入产品Bigone。另外，即将在神经介入治疗领域大放异彩的是AI人工智能技术，临床医生现在可以通过智能手机查看病人的核磁共振扫描或CT扫描结果，AI人工智能算法还能为医生提供疾病诊断和治疗方案的参考。有临床医生跟我说，当他走进医院时，只需看一下手机，AI智能便可以建议他应该采取什么方式治疗。选用哪种治疗方案或策略取决于临床医生的评判，但AI人工智能技术将大大缩短脑卒中患者从接诊到治疗的时间。

I think of those 3 medical devices that are in use right now as clearly breakthrough medical devices. Also, another technology I would add that's coming on the stage now is artificial intelligence, where physicians on their mobile phone see the results of a patient’s MRI scan or CT scan and the algorithm is actually diagnosing the disease. The technology is offering treatment options. When I speak with physicians, they are telling me I look at my phone when I walk into the hospital, my phone is telling me what the therapy should be. They make the judgment if it's the right therapy, but the technology is providing a faster turnaround time from the onset of stroke to getting the patient on the table and getting the patient treated.

所以，我认为神经介入领域目前里程碑式的产品不是一个，而是四个Bigone。

So, I’m going with four instead of one, just because I think they're all such important breakthroughs.

Q10

十年后Bigone，您认为临床仍会使用弹簧圈吗？

Do you think coil will survive in next decade?

A10：毫无疑问，未来20年弹簧圈肯定会继续在临床应用Bigone。很多业内人士说，血流导向装置将会取代弹簧圈。

Yes, absolutely. I see coils being around for the next 20 years. Many people in the industry have been saying when flow diverters first came out would be the demise of coils.

但我认为血流导向装置作为治疗颅内动脉瘤的治疗选择之一，它和弹簧圈是相辅相成的，共同提供解决方案Bigone。我认为，将会有更多辅助器械联合弹簧圈栓塞，进一步改善动脉瘤的治疗。而弹簧圈本身的性能也将不断完善，为临床提供更多选择。我预期未来至少20年，弹簧圈仍会持续应用在临床。

The technologies are additive and together provide treatment options. Both have their place and coils are still and will continued to be used. I think what will happen is coils as a standalone therapy will now be augmented with additional devices, devices being used with coils to further enhance aneurysm therapy. Coils will continue to improve and provide for market opportunity. I expect coils for at least the next 20 years will be used and getting market opportunity.

* 中文翻译仅供参考，所有内容以英文原文为准Bigone。

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